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starman_
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 Posted: Sat Sep 20, 2008 3:19 am Post subject: |
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Vatican: Guess what, Darwin? Evolution is OK
Catholic Church says theory of evolution is compatible with the Bible
VATICAN CITY - The Vatican said on Tuesday the theory of evolution was compatible with the Bible but planned no posthumous apology to Charles Darwin for the cold reception it gave him 150 years ago.
Archbishop Gianfranco Ravasi, the Vatican's culture minister, was speaking at the announcement of a Rome conference of scientists, theologians and philosophers to be held next March marking the 150th anniversary of the publication of Darwin's "The Origin of Species."
Christian churches were long hostile to Darwin because his theory conflicted with the literal biblical account of creation.
Earlier this week, a leading Anglican churchman, Rev. Malcolm Brown, said the Church of England owed Darwin an apology for the way his ideas were received by Anglicans in Britain.
Pope Pius XII described evolution as a valid scientific approach to the development of humans in 1950 and Pope John Paul reiterated that in 1996. But Ravasi said the Vatican had no intention of apologizing for earlier negative views.
"Maybe we should abandon the idea of issuing apologies as if history was a court eternally in session," he said, adding that Darwin's theories were "never condemned by the Catholic Church nor was his book ever banned."
Creationism is the belief that God created the world in six days as described in the Bible. The Catholic Church does not read the Genesis account of creation literally, saying it is an allegory for the way God created the world.
Some other Christians, mostly conservative Protestants in the United States, read Genesis literally and object to evolution being taught in biology class in public high schools.
Sarah Palin, the Republican candidate for the U.S. vice presidency, said in 2006 that she supported teaching both creationism and evolution in schools but has subsequently said creationism does not have to be part of curriculum.
The Catholic Church teaches "theistic evolution," a stand that accepts evolution as a scientific theory and sees no reason why God could not have used a natural evolutionary process in the forming of the human species.
It objects to using evolution as the basis for an atheist philosophy that denies God's existence or any divine role in creation. It also objects to using Genesis as a scientific text.
As Ravasi put it, creationism belongs to the "strictly theological sphere" and could not be used "ideologically in science."
Professor Philip Sloan of Notre Dame University, which is jointly holding next year's conference with Rome's Pontifical Gregorian University, said the gathering would be an important contribution to explaining the Catholic stand on evolution.
"In the United States, and now elsewhere, we have an ongoing public debate over evolution that has social, political and religious dimensions," he said.
"Most of this debate has been taking place without a strong Catholic theological presence, and the discussion has suffered accordingly," he said.
Pope Benedict discussed these issues with his former doctoral students at their annual meeting in 2006. In a speech in Paris last week, he spoke out against biblical literalism. |
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starman_
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| Posted: Mon Sep 29, 2008 7:47 am Post subject: |
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_________________
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evutch
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| Posted: Mon Sep 29, 2008 3:35 pm Post subject: |
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any half brained creationist that dosen't understand the diff between science theory, and religious theory, cannot be argued with.
let them go, i have talked to alot more scientists that say the more they learn, the more miraculas evolution, and the beginning of life looks..
i haven't heard too many half learned creationists able to explain any resonable science findings, that aren't twisted to fit some bible.
nor any biblical history put under true science testing..
with any real conclusive findings..
it's a shame that american education has come this direction. |
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starman_
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| Posted: Sat Oct 11, 2008 7:40 am Post subject: |
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Creationist Adnan Oktar offers trillion-pound prize for fossil proof of evolution
Adnan Oktar, a creationist and rival of Richard Dawkins, has offered trillions of pounds to any scientists who can show proof of evolution.
By Chris Irvine
Last Updated: 1:58PM BST 29 Sep 2008
Mr Oktar, 52, who successfully campaigned for Mr Dawkins' official website to be banned in Turkey, has said he will give 10 trillion Turkish lira, roughly equal to £4.4trn "to anyone who produces a single intermediate-form fossil demonstrating evolution."
Mr Oktar is a household name in Turkey after publishing hundreds of books, pamphlets and DVDs to contest Darwin's theory of evolution.
Using the pen name Harun Yahya, his book The Atlas Of Creation sold 10,000 copies worldwide.
The 800-page book detailed his claims that for millions of years life forms have not developed, thus supporting his Islamic creationist beliefs.
The former architecture student claims there are no fossils to support Charles Darwin's theory of evolution.
He said: "Not one [fossil] belongs to strange-looking creatures in the course of development of the kind supposed by evolutionists."
His views have been dismissed by critics however.
Dr Kevin Padian from the University of California told The New York Times Mr Oktar "does not have any sense of what we know about how things change through time", while the concept of extinction "does not seem to bother him".
Mr Oktar recently successfully campaigned for Mr Dawkins' website to be banned in Turkey.
He had complained he and his book had been defamed by comments made by Mr Dawkins, and also claimed the site included blasphemous and defamatory content.
Mr Dawkins had written of Mr Oktar's book: "I am at a loss to reconcile the expensive and glossy production values of this book with the breathtaking inanity of the content."
Mr Oktar had responded: "We could have spoken on a more scientific basis if he had been able to produce an intermediate form fossil capable of confirming evolution in the face of all the hundreds of fossils in my book."
Mr Oktar has also defended Professor Michael Reiss, the British biologist who resigned as the director of education for the Royal Society earlier this month after suggesting science teachers should tackle creationism if the matter is raised by pupils.
I Just Won 7.48 Trillion Dollars |
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fortwynt
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| Posted: Sat Oct 11, 2008 11:47 am Post subject: |
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| starman_ wrote: |
The topic came up after county resident Joel Fanti told the board he thought it was unfair for evolution to be taught as fact, saying it should be taught as a theory because there's no tangible proof it's true.
"The law says we can't have Bibles in schools, but we can have evolution, of the atheists."
So, according to these nut jobs, I guess the sun still revolves around the earth and evolution is an atheist agenda. Give me a fracking break.  |
I dont think evolution was created as an atheist agenda but i definitely think it is used in this way many times....maybe not an "atheist" agenda, as much as an "anti-spirituality" agenda.
I personally respect all beliefs, even evolution, since that's what I consider it to be in the grand scheme of things. "Evidence" aside. I can give you evidence or numbers supporting just about any wild idea that can be thought of....as polls for this and that regularly demonstrate.
I greatly respect someone who believes in evolution who can also say "on the other hand, I could be wrong, but this is what I believe", same was as I respect a "bible" person who can say the same. |
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theking
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| Posted: Sat Oct 11, 2008 11:53 am Post subject: |
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Oh look, yet another moron claiming his absolutism.
Ring the bells of a nutjob. |
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"The difference between you and I is that I came from nothing, thus have nothing to ever truly lose." |
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fortwynt
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| Posted: Sat Oct 11, 2008 12:22 pm Post subject: |
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| theking wrote: |
Oh look, yet another moron claiming his absolutism.
Ring the bells of a nutjob. |
Me?
I challenge you to find one phrase I typed which is absolutist....i would say quite the opposite.
Moron?
come now...name calling? |
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theking
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| Posted: Sat Oct 11, 2008 2:07 pm Post subject: |
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| fortwynt wrote: |
| theking wrote: |
Oh look, yet another moron claiming his absolutism.
Ring the bells of a nutjob. |
Me?
I challenge you to find one phrase I typed which is absolutist....i would say quite the opposite.
Moron?
come now...name calling? |
Not you fort.
I respect and cherish your typed words. |
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"The difference between you and I is that I came from nothing, thus have nothing to ever truly lose." |
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fortwynt
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| Posted: Sat Oct 11, 2008 2:58 pm Post subject: |
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| theking wrote: |
| fortwynt wrote: |
| theking wrote: |
Oh look, yet another moron claiming his absolutism.
Ring the bells of a nutjob. |
Me?
I challenge you to find one phrase I typed which is absolutist....i would say quite the opposite.
Moron?
come now...name calling? |
Not you fort.
I respect and cherish your typed words. |
Whoops, sorry about that my friend. |
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starman_
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| Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2008 12:39 pm Post subject: |
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The ordained Church of England minister said the idea that the Earth was made by God 10,000 years ago should be discussed if pupils raise it, because "banging on" about natural selection would not lead evangelical Christians or Muslims to change their views.
One in three teachers says teach creationism alongside evolution
What is the science standards issue currently before the Texas State Board of Education (SBOE)?
During 2008-09, the Texas SBOE is reviewing the state's science standards, the Texas Essential Knowledge and Skills (TEKS) for science, which were originally adopted in 1998. The controversial issue before the SBOE is whether the TEKS will retain existing language calling for students to learn about both the scientific "strengths and weaknesses" of scientific theories. Some have proposed removing that language from the TEKS entirely, while others have suggested that good science education that encourages critical thinking should apply to all aspects of the curriculum, especially to the teaching of controversial scientific theories like neo-Darwinian evolution.
Q&A About Texas Science Standards Review and Debate Over How to Teach Evolution |
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evutch
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| Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2008 4:07 pm Post subject: |
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religious fundalmentalist retro thinking kooks can push ignorance and a back slide from education all they want..
but the cats out of the bag..
scientific theory, backed by research, and not religious theory, backed by belief in primative superstitions, will win out.
i personnaly, have no problem, with ignorant parents, wanting their children to remain loyal subjects to dogmatic oppression.
however, the educated, seem perfectly able to balence, spiritual belief, along with educated research.
teaching religion in state schools, and denying higher education is dangerous. however, maybe an education in over simplified stupidity should be explored so as to teach children the difference between rational investigation of provable theories, vs made up theories that hold only in pretend imagination.
if people wish to retrograde, into simple minded superstition on their own, and deny higher education to their young, allow them, but send thier own kids to these places of lower learning.
i could not care less, wether an adult understnds scientific principles or not.
the land needs undereducated masses to do labor..keeping them dumb and ignorant keeps them controllable.
the elite and uper educated, have no such needs for limits.
i know there are those who believe that somehow believing in stupidity somehow pleases god, and therefor makes for a strong country..
however, allowing other countries to get a jump on technology derived from science usually results in a slip of power, from repression of advacement.
i think those that have the smarts to understand advanced science will survive a bogyman angry god very well, and can risk their "souls" for not adhering to some fairytale book contrived some centuries ago to control masses.
and it's also obvious that this hijacking of a political party in this country by the fundalmentalists is resulting in a dumber and soon extinct right wing..
if this is what happens to such powers, by all means, dumb down your children, but cease trying to push it on the general public as a pretend knowlege. |
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TNuke
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| Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 12:41 am Post subject: |
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Yeah I agree. We should get rid of all that "brother's keeper" crap that Obama won't shut up about. Get rid of that "Thou shalt, thou shalt not" crap too. F the world, murder at will. What a great world that will be.
You can murder as many people as you like, just call it "peace" and do it for "free". That'll get every left wing whack job on your side. You can go Hitler style or Stalin style. Throw in a little Mao, Pol Pot, Napolean or Musolini and you're all set. |
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"Sic semper evello mortem Tyrannis."
Welcome to 1984 citizen! |
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starman_
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| Posted: Wed Nov 12, 2008 5:21 am Post subject: |
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| Crime rates increase and decrease mostly with the age of the population. There is no correlation between crime and teaching evolution. In general, the US was more violent between the years 1870-1910 before evolution was taught. Also, there is a negative correlation between crime and teaching evolution regionally. Countries that teach evolution to a greater extent than the US have a lower crime rate. Correlation and causation are not one and the same. In the US, most people don't believe in evolution. If a societies social wrong doings follow from belief about origins, creationists deserve more of the responsibility. |
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screamzero
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| Posted: Thu Nov 13, 2008 12:56 am Post subject: |
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| The theory of evolution suggests a magnificent G-d...and does not detract from the life miracle we now live nor does it detract from the theory/ experience of a smart and wise G-d. None of us really see very well, now do we? |
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TNuke
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| Posted: Sat Nov 15, 2008 12:53 am Post subject: |
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| starman_ wrote: |
| Crime rates increase and decrease mostly with the age of the population. There is no correlation between crime and teaching evolution. In general, the US was more violent between the years 1870-1910 before evolution was taught. Also, there is a negative correlation between crime and teaching evolution regionally. Countries that teach evolution to a greater extent than the US have a lower crime rate. Correlation and causation are not one and the same. In the US, most people don't believe in evolution. If a societies social wrong doings follow from belief about origins, creationists deserve more of the responsibility. |
One has nothing to do with the other. Just because A happened then B happened does not mean that A caused B. You need to take a course in basic logic, as do most of the religion bashers here. See, the so-called "logical" people don't even know their own philosophy. They don't even know that it is a philosophy.
Case in point: If you are a 1 dimensional creature, can you perceive anything from the 2nd or 3rd dimensions? No.
If you are a 2 dimensional creature, can you perceive anything from the 3rd dimension? No.
If you are a 3 dimensional creature, can you perceive anything from any higher dimension? No.
This suggests that one of the most basic principles of science could indeed be wrong. And that is that what our senses tell us is completely correct, and all there is.
Oh, and you didn't bother to mention the level violence in the world before Christianity took over. You left that little part out. |
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Welcome to 1984 citizen! |
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