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greeney2
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Joined: Sep 28, 2001
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 Posted: Sat Aug 30, 2008 10:24 am Post subject: |
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As wrong as I think Saturos is, at least he tries to explain his position. Personanongrata you add nothing, and your yawning makes be wish you would just go take a nap, and not bother. 
Maybe you don;t think other Christians can get turned off with judgmental off the wall Christians who can;t listen to anyone either. Becasue if someone like Saturos, has whatever ideas he has, the last thing to help isa lecture about damnation. I don;t see you are much different with your minds made up about all Christians, and for you Satoros all Muslims. I don;t believe for a second every Christian you have talked to has been near as bad as you discribe. You are probably ready for battle the second you start talking, and for that matter why feel you need to force you views on them. When you open the door to debate or approval, what do you expect? |
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Nesaie
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| Posted: Sat Aug 30, 2008 2:14 pm Post subject: |
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| fortwynt wrote: |
| Halfabo wrote: |
| fortwynt wrote: |
Eh...I find the same strict idea-ology whether it be on the part of religious fundamentalists or people staunchly buried in political leanings.
Try arguing for gun rights to a gun-ban whacko and you'll get the same cold attitude of derision and shame projected onto you.
Believe me, it isn't limited to religious nuts. |
I have found that it doesn't have to be a strict ideology, just a currently held belief in whatever the subject. |
True enough!
And you are right. Christians ARE singled out. |
By whom?
Side track here, from another thread which I haven't found, what you said about dismissing the whole old testament, including the 10 commandments, that form of Christianity I can get. 
Back on track...
From the articles I read around the world, the techniques of conversion that fundamentalist christians use for conversion are really low. It's also helped to create terrorism. Due to these practices, Christians and Muslims have created Hindu terrorists.
When people try to convert others to give money (because we all know its a money game) by fear mongering of the unknown, that is dirty. Then, they go into the most impoverished areas of countries and use their fear tactics and the promise of food, clothing and shelter to also convert...its like the "good cop/bad cop" thing. Its sad and cruel.
Now, to the Christians who actually do try to follow Jesus, well thats a whole different brand. |
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Soma: All the advantages of Christianity and alcohol; none of their defects.
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screamzero
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Joined: Feb 08, 2008
Posts: 2117
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| Posted: Sat Aug 30, 2008 5:12 pm Post subject: |
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| Nesaie wrote: |
| fortwynt wrote: |
| Halfabo wrote: |
| fortwynt wrote: |
Eh...I find the same strict idea-ology whether it be on the part of religious fundamentalists or people staunchly buried in political leanings.
Try arguing for gun rights to a gun-ban whacko and you'll get the same cold attitude of derision and shame projected onto you.
Believe me, it isn't limited to religious nuts. |
I have found that it doesn't have to be a strict ideology, just a currently held belief in whatever the subject. |
True enough!
And you are right. Christians ARE singled out. |
By whom?
Side track here, from another thread which I haven't found, what you said about dismissing the whole old testament, including the 10 commandments, that form of Christianity I can get.
Back on track...
From the articles I read around the world, the techniques of conversion that fundamentalist christians use for conversion are really low. It's also helped to create terrorism. Due to these practices, Christians and Muslims have created Hindu terrorists.
When people try to convert others to give money (because we all know its a money game) by fear mongering of the unknown, that is dirty. Then, they go into the most impoverished areas of countries and use their fear tactics and the promise of food, clothing and shelter to also convert...its like the "good cop/bad cop" thing. Its sad and cruel.
Now, to the Christians who actually do try to follow Jesus, well thats a whole different brand. |
The fundamentalists that convert people to blow people up have a conversion technique (because we all know it's a power game); which is much more violent and effective to a ludicrous end; I'll wager they bear a very large responsibility for history's many wars.:
Contemporary global politics is the age of Muslim wars. Muslims fight each other and they fight non-Muslims far more often than do peoples of other civilizations. Muslim wars have replaced the cold war as the principal form of international conflict. These wars include wars of terrorism, guerrilla wars, civil wars and interstate conflicts. These instances of Muslim violence could congeal into one major clash of civilizations between Islam and the West or between Islam and the Rest. That, however, is not inevitable, and it is more likely that violence involving Muslims will remain dispersed, varied and frequent.
The age of Muslim wars began as the cold war was winding down in the 1980s. In 1980 Iraq invaded Iran, and the ensuing war produced at least 500,000 deaths and hundreds of thousands of wounded. At the same time, the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan generated vigorous Afghan resistance, which by 1989 compelled the Soviets to withdraw. This victory was made possible by American technology, Saudi and American money, Pakistani support and training, and the participation of thousands of fighters from other, mostly Arab, Muslim countries. Then in 1990 Saddam Hussein invaded and attempted to annex Kuwait, and the United States organized an international coalition, including several Muslim countries, to defeat him.
In the 1990s violence occurred between Muslims and non-Muslims in Bosnia, Kosovo, Macedonia, Chechnya, Azerbaijan, Tajikistan, Kashmir, India, the Philippines, Indonesia, the Middle East, Sudan and Nigeria. Mujahedin fighters from the Afghanistan war were central participants in many of these conflicts as well as in Muslim terrorist organizations in countries throughout the world. In the mid-1990s, roughly half the ethnic conflicts in the world involved Muslims fighting each other or non-Muslims. In one inventory by The Economist, Muslims were responsible for 11 and possibly 12 of 16 major acts of international terrorism between 1983 and 2000. Five of the seven states listed by the U.S. State Department as supporting terrorism are Muslim, as are a majority of foreign organizations listed as engaged in terrorism. In counter-actions between 1980 and 1995, the U.S. armed forces engaged in 17 military operations against Muslims. According to the International Institute of Strategic Studies, 32 armed conflicts were underway in 2000; more than two thirds involved Muslims. Yet Muslims are only about one fifth of the world’s population.
The "new war" as U.S. administration officials termed the violence that began September 11, is thus not so new. It is a continuation and escalation of previous patterns of violence involving Muslims. Earlier Muslim terrorism had, however, been sporadic and in comparison relatively limited: 299 people killed in the 1983 attack on the U.S. Marine barracks in Beirut, 270 on Pan Am Flight 103 in 1988, 224 in the 1998 attacks on U.S. African embassies. Different Muslim groups and states were involved in these incidents. Beginning in 1993, however, the principal attacks on Americans and American facilities all appear to have originated with Osama bin Laden. September 11 revealed the existence of his sizable global terrorist network with cells in perhaps 40 countries and with the expertise and resources to attempt well-planned simultaneous attacks. Also for the first time, the network struck with devastating effect within the United States, its actions highlighting the likelihood of chemical and biological attacks, with the more distant possibility of nuclear weapons. The age of Muslim wars had come home to America.
Responsibility for particular wars undoubtedly varies, with the Sudanese government responsible for its ongoing war against Christians and the Israeli government provoking the second intifada with its settlements and ongoing military presence in the West Bank and Gaza.
Tribal. Religious, ethnic, political and cultural divisions within the Muslim world stimulate violence between Muslims. They also promote violence between Muslims and non-Muslims because different Muslim groups and governments, such as those of Saudi Arabia and Iran, compete with each other in promoting their own brand of Islam and have supported Muslim groups fighting non-Muslims from Bosnia to the Philippines. If one or two states dominated the Muslim world, which has not been the case since the end of the Ottoman Empire, less violence would occur among Muslims and, probably between Muslims and non-Muslims.
http://www.hvk.org/articles/1003/48.html
The FACT that your a socialist gad fly explains your attraction to these worshipers of OBLIGATORY conversions. Here's why...and you thought you weren't brain washed:
Pan-Arabism - Frustrated Arab nationalist ambitions and socialist and fascist ideologies gave rise to several movements and political parties. In particular, the Ba'ath party was founded in Syria in 1928 by Michel Aflak and Salah al-Din Bitar with a pan-Arab nationalist program and elements of both Marxism and fascism. Aflak and Bitar were influenced by Arab nationalist trends that had begun in time of the Turks, inspired in part by the Islamic and Arab reform ideologies of Jamal al-Din al-Afghani (1839-1897), his student Muhammad Abduh (1849-1905), and Abduh's student, Muhammad Rashid Rida (1865-1935). These thinkers called for a renewal of Islam, with limited borrowing of concepts from the West. Abduh in particular was active in promoting Arab autonomy within Ottoman Turkey, and had placed great hopes in the Young Turks. Rida grew increasingly anti-Western with time, and was a great influence on Hassan El-Banna, who founded the Muslim Brotherhood. While Aflak was a Greek Orthodox Christian, Ba'ath ideology adopted an affinity for Islam, and Pan-Arabists saw one of their goals as asserting the primacy of the Arabs in the Muslim world.
http://www.mideastweb.org/islamhistory.htm
Because of your subconscious Marxist leanings you picked up here in the States during the Great Washing of Relativism from the sixties to the present, you are attracted to their propaganda as well; as are most all Democratic Socialists. This is why you spew twisted facts and slander and more propaganda to "win" your rationalized points.. Your a sick puppy.
Age of the Caliphs:
Expansion under Muhammad, 622-632
Expansion during the Rashidun Caliphate, 632-661
Expansion during the Umayyad Caliphate, 661-750
Conquests of Muhammad and the Rashidun
Under the Rashidun
* The conquest of Syria, 637
* The conquest of Armenia, 639
* The conquest of Egypt, 639
* The conquest of North Africa, 652
The muslim (green area) domination of the Mediterranean world in 800 AD.
Byzantine-Arab Wars: 634-750
Under the Umayyads
* The conquest of North Africa, 665
* The second Arab siege of Constantinople 717-718
* The conquest of Tbilisi, 736
Later conquests
* The conquest of southern Italy, 827
Conquest of Persia: 633-651
Conquest of Transoxiana: 662-709
Conquest of Sindh: 664-712
Conquest of Hispania: 711-718
Conquest of the Caucasus: 711-750
End of the Umayyad conquests: 718-750
Conquest of Nubia: 700-1606
incursions into Southern Italy: 831-902
Conquest of Anatolia: 1060-1360
Byzantine-Ottoman Wars: 1299-1453
Further conquests: 1200-1800
Further information: Ottoman wars in Europe
In Sub-Saharan Africa, the Sahelian kingdom expanded Muslim territories far from the coast. Muslim traders spread Islam to kingdoms across Zanj along the east African coast, and to Southeast Asia and the sultanates of Southeast Asia such as those of Mataram and Sulu.
After the Mongol Empire destroyed the Abbasid Caliphate, after the Battle of Baghdad (1258), they conquered Muslim lands but soon converted to Islam, beginning an era of Turkic and Mongol expansions of Muslim rule into Eastern Europe under the Golden Horde; across Central Asia under Timur, founder of the Timurid dynasty; and later into the Indian subcontinent under his descendant Babur, founder of the Mughal Empire. Meanwhile in the 17th century, Barbary pirates were conducting raids into Western and Northern Europe, as far as Britain and Iceland.[5][6] Eastern Europe suffered a series of Tatar invasions, the goal of which was to loot, pillage and capture slaves into jasyr.[7]
The modern era saw the rise of three powerful Muslim empires: the Ottoman Empire of the Middle East and Europe, the Safavid Empire of Persia and Central Asia, and the Mughal Empire of India; along with their contest and fall to the rise of the colonial powers of Europe.
Decline and collapse: 1800-1924
This sure hasn't held them back though; because of recent history: (1980's forward - I refer you to the beginning of this reply to your propagandized crap about who has a real dereliction to convert; and by blood.)
You and your ilk spew all this garbage about Jews and Christians: have any of these two proved more gregarious towards world domination? NO! I tell you, pup, only Genghis Kahn; Alexander the Great; and Hitler have proven such a great propensity. Not even Bonaparte made Greater strides; nor the Christian crusade ( a reaction to Islamic brutality) nor your twisted definitions of Zionists have nurtured such relentless fire and Conquests as has the Muslim radical militants THROUGHOUT HISTORY!! Read the time line and deny your face off. None of them used religion and none of them has proven a greater propensity for Conquer or religious conversion and dominion as have Muslim Conquerers through out history.
You and maelstroke's asinine worry of Jewish hegemony are so brittle that you look like loons in the face of historical argument:
Crusading ideals in the West were an answer to the greater threat of jihad. They were spurred by fear and necessity in a desperate competition with Islam that, for many centuries, Christians lost—and were aware that they were losing. The extent of Islam’s victories can be seen in the all-but-complete disappearance of the once-thriving Christian communities in North Africa, the Middle East, and Western Asia, as well as the deep roots that Islam still has in the Balkans—a region whose very name was imposed upon it by successful late medieval Turkish imperialism.
Islam is a remarkably successful religion that for most of its existence has inspired its adherents to creatively synthesize the often-conflicting requirements of warfare, imperial politics, and missionary zeal. Projecting Western freedom of action backward in time seriously distorts the more dramatic story of ongoing Western weakness that almost destroyed Christendom. The pathos and peril of much of contemporary radical Islam’s protest against the West is not fueled primarily by aggrieved victimhood; it is nourished by an even stronger memory of how Islam’s final victory over Christendom remained for so long a real possibility. Muslim triumphs in earlier centuries were the crucible that forged both Christendom’s fears and Islam’s confidence.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1518725/posts
Your blindness is only superseded by your ghastly ignorance:
Where To Start? What To Consider?
We start by considering history itself. Both the religion of Islam and Western Society has its own versions of what it considers the truth, of its' history as well as how it views the others' history. Before we start we must consider which version we wish to follow, or how much of each we wish to accept; And then we must consider the consequences of any combination thereof. And from a Western viewpoint we must also consider what we call revisionist history. This is because revisionist history is based upon the theory and philosophy that everything has an opposing viewpoint, and the only opposing viewpoint to what has been written about Islam, from a Western viewpoint, is something relating to or integrating some Islamic viewpoints.
The combinations and conditions are as follows: Accept Islamic history, you will disagree with this article. Accept revisionist history and you will disagree with this article. Accept some of both standard Western History and Islamic or revisionist history and you will not only disagree with parts of this article, you will have shown you have no basis for arbitrarily choosing either, but ONLY what you want to believe. This would mean you most likely have a lot of wishful thinking, hoping for the best without due consideration to the reality of the facts as presented from the accepted standards of past Western History. This would come from a good dose of the humanistic courses now taught at all school levels, including college. (This has become increasingly worse over the last 30 years. ) Modern mind conditioning from too much television and mass media also helps to drastically develop this mindset.
http://www.shalomjerusalem.com/mohammedism/mohammedism11.html |
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Saturos
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Joined: Feb 19, 2003
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| Posted: Sat Aug 30, 2008 7:27 pm Post subject: |
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As wrong as I think Saturos is, at least he tries to explain his position. Personanongrata you add nothing, and your yawning makes be wish you would just go take a nap, and not bother.
Maybe you don;t think other Christians can get turned off with judgmental off the wall Christians who can;t listen to anyone either. Becasue if someone like Saturos, has whatever ideas he has, the last thing to help isa lecture about damnation. I don;t see you are much different with your minds made up about all Christians, and for you Satoros all Muslims. I don;t believe for a second every Christian you have talked to has been near as bad as you discribe. You are probably ready for battle the second you start talking, and for that matter why feel you need to force you views on them. When you open the door to debate or approval, what do you expect? |
First of all they start this kind of conversation not me.
They get angry and ready to battle before me.
You probably don´t want to think they are like that because it hits you directly in what you believe and have incommon with them.
Atleast I have a valid reason to why I see them as I do unlike them. |
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The truth is hidden so well, it´s right infront of you... |
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greeney2
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| Posted: Mon Sep 01, 2008 2:14 am Post subject: |
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Assuming this is true, which I don't believe, on how many occasions has this happened for you to say all Christians are like that?
Your religious bigoty is no different than the anti-gay bigoty you are imagining. |
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Harvster
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Joined: Jan 12, 2008
Posts: 11
Location: USA Virginia
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| Posted: Mon Sep 01, 2008 3:30 am Post subject: |
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| LOL satuos i see you stiring the pot everywhere you go |
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screamzero
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Joined: Feb 08, 2008
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| Posted: Tue Sep 02, 2008 1:37 am Post subject: |
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| Curiosity killed the cat, but satisfaction brought him back... |
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NCC1701
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Joined: Aug 13, 2008
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Location: right in front of you!
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| Posted: Tue Sep 02, 2008 2:40 pm Post subject: |
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'born again' christians should read(esp Westboro Baptist Church pathological nutcases) Romans 14 concerning judging other people.
WBC think that everyone else is condemed except themselves.
Jesus says "You judge by human standards I judge no one"
Hindus see Jesus as a prophet and God in the flesh.Christian fundsy's think hindus will burn in hell,where does it say that in the bible??
Christian fundy's are EVIL,SICK,IGNORANT BASTARDS!!!
AND THATS WHAT BLIND FAITH,IGNORANCE AND BLACK AND WHITE THINKING LEADS TO!!!! |
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Questioner101
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Joined: Apr 04, 2007
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| Posted: Tue Sep 02, 2008 3:11 pm Post subject: |
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| This is beginning to sound like Frank Herbert and his son Brian's "Dune" series.... |
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_________________
\\\"I´m disenclined to acquiese to your request...\\\" |
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Personanongrata
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Joined: Dec 31, 2007
Posts: 1817
Location: NAU
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| Posted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 6:52 pm Post subject: |
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| greeney2 wrote: |
As wrong as I think Saturos is, at least he tries to explain his position. Personanongrata you add nothing, and your yawning makes be wish you would just go take a nap, and not bother.
Maybe you don;t think other Christians can get turned off with judgmental off the wall Christians who can;t listen to anyone either. Becasue if someone like Saturos, has whatever ideas he has, the last thing to help isa lecture about damnation. I don;t see you are much different with your minds made up about all Christians, and for you Satoros all Muslims. I don;t believe for a second every Christian you have talked to has been near as bad as you discribe. You are probably ready for battle the second you start talking, and for that matter why feel you need to force you views on them. When you open the door to debate or approval, what do you expect? |
Speaking of explaining my position, you still haven't answered me in the Discrimination thread.... |
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_________________
__________________________________________
"The obstacle is the path." -- Zen Proverb.
"**ck it, we'll do it live." -- Bill O'Reilly.
"...................................." -- Harpo Marx. |
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Personanongrata
B.V. Info Seeker
Joined: Dec 31, 2007
Posts: 1817
Location: NAU
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| Posted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 7:01 pm Post subject: |
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| Questioner101 wrote: |
| This is beginning to sound like Frank Herbert and his son Brian's "Dune" series.... |
Good one.  |
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_________________
__________________________________________
"The obstacle is the path." -- Zen Proverb.
"**ck it, we'll do it live." -- Bill O'Reilly.
"...................................." -- Harpo Marx. |
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screamzero
B.V. Info Seeker
Joined: Feb 08, 2008
Posts: 2117
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| Posted: Wed Sep 17, 2008 7:40 am Post subject: |
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| NCC1701 wrote: |
'born again' christians should read(esp Westboro Baptist Church pathological nutcases) Romans 14 concerning judging other people.
WBC think that everyone else is condemed except themselves.
Jesus says "You judge by human standards I judge no one"
Hindus see Jesus as a prophet and God in the flesh.Christian fundsy's think hindus will burn in hell,where does it say that in the bible??
Christian fundy's are EVIL,SICK,IGNORANT BASTARDS!!!
AND THATS WHAT BLIND FAITH,IGNORANCE AND BLACK AND WHITE THINKING LEADS TO!!!! |
..nice judgment skills you have there , Your Greatness. |
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Questioner101
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| Posted: Wed Sep 17, 2008 9:09 am Post subject: |
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| Just remember, if mankind does finally get away from earth out to the stars....they take their tribal myths with them...heaven help heaven. |
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\\\"I´m disenclined to acquiese to your request...\\\" |
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screamzero
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| Posted: Wed Sep 17, 2008 12:54 pm Post subject: |
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| Questioner101 wrote: |
| Just remember, if mankind does finally get away from earth out to the stars....they take their tribal myths with them...heaven help heaven. |
I s'pose that means you'll stay behind, feet firmly planted on the gouger, playing with your myth. You've yet to prove you exist. All you are is just a bunch of electronic dots on this screen. Myth. |
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jwebb
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| Posted: Wed Sep 17, 2008 3:58 pm Post subject: |
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the older christians that i know, that go to church all the time and claim that they are christian arent really christian.
they are born into it and never lean away because they think that it is mandatory to go to church.
some people that i have just sat down and talked to ( from ages 15 to like 40 ) know abolutly NOTHING about christianity, except that " jesus died on a cross for us" and the ten comandments" and what the past 2 sermons were about, but thats pushing it.
but yah most people that claim that they are christian dont even know anything about their own faith.
and yes as a whole they are VERY judgemental. but people that i have seen in the catholic church are not as judgemental from what i have noticed, and i dont know why. |
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